# A Conversation with a Dispensational Christian Nationalist ![](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/LORlSLleauY/maxresdefault.jpg) ## Chris Luk and Christian Nationalism - Pastor Chris Luk, a dispensationalist and graduate of **The** **Master's** **Seminary** in [[Sun Valley, Los Angeles | Sun Valley]], [[California]], is a proponent of [[Christian nationalism]] and has a [[YouTube]] series called "How Should We Then Think" where he discusses this topic [(00:00:28)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=28s). - Chris Luk was instrumental in influencing some of the leadership at Grace Community Church to open up the church during the COVID-19 pandemic, and was referenced in a documentary about the church's stand on the issue [(00:01:38)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=98s). - Chris Luk has a background in theology and has studied the rich heritage of Christian thinkers throughout history, and believes that many of the debates about the relationship between the church and state are similar to those that occurred during the Reformation [(00:02:12)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=132s). - Chris Luk's dispensationalist views have led some to question whether he can be a Christian [[Nationalism | nationalist]], but he believes that his eschatology informs his views on the [[Role | role]] of the civil magistrate and the relationship between the church and state [(00:03:20)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=200s). ## Chris Luk's Journey to Christian Nationalism - Chris Luk's interest in the topic of [[Christian nationalism]] and the role of the civil magistrate was sparked by his studies and his desire to understand the biblical basis for the relationship between the church and state [(00:03:24)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=204s). - Chris Luk believes that Christians should not try to reinvent the wheel, but rather learn from the thinkers and theologians who have come before them, and that the [[Bible]] provides a clear framework for understanding the role of the church and state [(00:02:36)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=156s). - Coming to faith later in life led to a serious pursuit of submission to [[Jesus | Christ]] and obedience, which raised questions about the relationship between the church and government [(00:03:41)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=221s). - Studying anthropology and understanding the government's actions led to a healthy distrust, but also a need to balance submission to Christ with the [[Role | role]] of the church and individual Christians [(00:04:07)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=247s). ## The COVID-19 Pandemic and the Church's Stance - The COVID-19 pandemic brought these issues to the forefront, particularly when the decision was made to keep the church open despite government restrictions [(00:04:33)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=273s). - The church's autonomy and freedom from interference by other spheres, as stated in its doctrinal statement, was a key factor in this decision [(00:04:51)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=291s). ## The Church, Individual Christians, and Cultural Engagement - The use of imprecise language, such as referring to the church as encompassing both the institution and individual Christians, has been harmful and led to confusion about the roles of each [(00:05:09)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=309s). - [[Martin Luther]] and [[John MacArthur (American pastor) | John MacArthur]] have discussed the importance of distinguishing between the roles of the church and individual Christians, particularly in engaging with culture [(00:05:17)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=317s). - The decision to keep the church open was influenced by updates from missionary societies, such as Paul Washer's HeartCry Missionary Society, which showed Christians continuing to serve and evangelize despite government restrictions [(00:06:19)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=379s). - The experience of being in the minority position and facing criticism from other churches, including the sending church, highlighted the need for a clear understanding of [[Protestantism | Protestant]] political theory and the proper interpretation of [[Romans 13]] [(00:06:45)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=405s). ## Reexamining Romans 13 and Divinely Delegated Authority - The realization that many people, including pastors and theologians, are unable to address Romans 13 from a commentary more than 50 years old, underscored the need for a deeper understanding of these issues [(00:07:05)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=425s). - The realization of Caesar's authority not extending over the local church was triggered by the events of 2020, specifically the resistance to staying open, and this led to a deeper understanding of divinely delegated authority and its limitations [(00:07:22)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=442s). - The goal is to express the lordship of [[Jesus | Christ]] in every sphere, including the local church, and to navigate scenarios where civil magistrates may try to exert authority over the church [(00:08:16)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=496s). - As a local church Elder, the responsibility is to feed Christ's sheep and not to turn away members in good standing from assembling and partaking of the ordinances, as this authority has not been delegated by Christ [(00:08:30)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=510s). - The study of divinely delegated authority and its limitations in different spheres led to a deeper understanding of how to navigate situations where civil magistrates may try to exert authority over the church [(00:08:53)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=533s). ## The Church's Responsibility and the Lordship of Christ - The goal is to express the lordship of Christ in every sphere, including the local church, and to navigate scenarios where civil magistrates may try to exert authority over the church [(00:08:16)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=496s). - As a local church Elder, the responsibility is to feed Christ's sheep and not to turn away members in good standing from assembling and partaking of the ordinances, as this authority has not been delegated by [[Jesus | Christ]] [(00:08:30)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=510s). - The study of divinely delegated authority and its limitations in different spheres led to a deeper understanding of how to navigate situations where civil magistrates may try to exert authority over the church [(00:08:53)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=533s). - The church's decision to keep gathering and teaching despite external pressures was a result of this understanding, and the members were in agreement with this decision [(00:09:14)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=554s). ## Dispensationalism and Political Involvement - Some people have reached out to express excitement about the fact that [[Dispensationalism | dispensationalism]] does not hinder involvement in politics or the idea of Christian nations, and they see this as an example of being able to navigate these issues despite eschatology [(00:09:27)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=567s). - There is a certain strain of postmillennialism that tends to be influenced by reconstruction and theonomy, and they argue that dispensationalism is the problem that prevents Christians from being involved in politics and doing good [(00:10:17)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=617s). - However, it is pointed out that many founding fathers of the religious right, such as [[Jerry Falwell]], [[Pat Robertson]], and [[James Dobson]], were dispensationalists, and their descendants and other Christian groups also hold to dispensationalism while being involved in politics [(00:10:42)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=642s). - Dispensationalists are more involved in actual political endeavors compared to postmillennialists, who are less active in this area [(00:11:13)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=673s). ## Dispensationalism, Eschatology, and Political Theology - To justify their political position, dispensationalists should be consistent in their arguments and consider the inescapable conclusions of their eschatology [(00:11:40)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=700s). - [[Dispensationalism]] was not the dominant eschatology during the Reformation, and its influence on current affairs should not be overstated [(00:12:03)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=723s). - Premillennial complementarianism is distinct from postmillennial or amillennial complementarianism, and its differences should be acknowledged [(00:12:23)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=743s). - Complementarianism is exercised in a particular sphere and is not directly influenced by eschatology, making it relevant to the [[Christian nationalism]] debate [(00:12:36)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=756s). - The concept of delegated authority within the civil sphere is more important than eschatology in determining how authority should be exercised [(00:12:41)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=761s). - The idea that dispensationalism is incompatible with Christian [[Nationalism | nationalism]] is challenged by the fact that a card-carrying amillennialist wrote a famous book on the subject [(00:13:14)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=794s). - Stephen Wolfe, often associated with postmillennialism, is actually an amillennialist, and this distinction should be recognized [(00:13:18)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=798s). ## The Sojourner Identity of the Church - The Sojourner identity of the church is a contentious issue, and dispensationalists often inconsistently apply this concept to the modern church [(00:13:43)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=823s). - The Apostle Peter's writings about the church as sojourners and aliens were addressed to [[Jews]] in the diaspora, not the modern church, which is not in exile [(00:13:55)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=835s). - Calvin and most of church history have interpreted Peter's writings as addressing the Jews, not the universal church [(00:14:45)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=885s). - Dispensationalists believe that in the future, during the Eternal State, there will be nations and kings, as stated in [[Revelation 21]], and a future nation of [[Israel]] will exist, with the diaspora being the exiles and sojourners, awaiting God's regathering of the Jews post-conversion [(00:14:56)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=896s). ## The Cultural Mandate and Christian Engagement - The cultural mandate, also known as the kingdom mandate or Dominion mandate, is still in play, according to some dispensationalists, who believe that Christians have an obligation to engage with culture, as indicated in scripture, with examples such as [[Psalm 8]], where David points out that humans are supposed to have dominion, which will not be completely fulfilled until [[Jesus | Christ]] comes [(00:15:37)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=937s). - Some dispensationalists, like Mike Block, teach that the cultural mandate is still in place, as stated in the MacArthur Mayew Systematic Theology textbook, and that it is not yet completely fulfilled [(00:15:53)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=953s). ## Eschatology and Its Influence on Christian Disagreements - There are different views within [[Dispensationalism | dispensationalism]] regarding the timing of the turning point in history, with some believing it was 1776, while others think it may have been a high mark post-Ascension, but this does not affect the individual's faithfulness and what [[God]] has called them to do right now [(00:16:34)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=994s). - The eschatology debate may be masking other actual disagreements within [[Christianity]], and attributing all disagreements to this particular issue may not be accurate [(00:17:10)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1030s). - Some individuals, including postmillennialists and premillennialists, use their eschatology system as an ideology, applying it to every aspect of life, which can lead to problems such as escapism or compromising the gospel [(00:17:36)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1056s). - Despite differences in eschatology, most Christians agree on fundamental things, such as Christ's return, the new Heaven, and the [[New Earth (Christianity) | New Earth]], with the main differences being in the "particular flavors" of how to get there [(00:18:02)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1082s). - The problem arises when eschatology is used to justify escapism or the idea that taking over every institution is part of the gospel, which can lead to heretical waters and compromise the gospel [(00:18:14)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1094s). - The eschatologies themselves are not necessarily the problems, but rather the tendencies attached to them, and the focus should be on understanding the lordship of [[Jesus | Christ]] and its expression in this sphere [(00:18:37)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1117s). - Having a postmillennial position can be seen as a crutch for some, as it provides a sense of triumph and victory, but it's not necessary for faithfulness, and one can be faithful without needing a specific outcome [(00:19:01)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1141s). - Even in a postmillennial scheme, the ultimate goal is to win and rule in the end, but the focus should be on being faithful and leaving the results to [[God]] [(00:19:37)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1177s). ## Personal Experiences with Eschatology in Seminary - The speaker attended seminary at [[Master's degree | Master's]] and later transferred to South Eastern, where they explored different eschatologies, but it didn't help clarify their understanding [(00:19:52)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1192s). - In a theology class, the professor asked students to raise their hands for their eschatological views, and the speaker was one of only two dispensationalists in the class, which was surprising given the [[Southern Baptist Convention (SBC) | Southern Baptist]] background [(00:20:25)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1225s). - The speaker notes that the Southern Baptists had shifted away from [[Dispensationalism | dispensationalism]] in recent years, and that postmillennialism was more prevalent, even among those with a social justice leaning [(00:21:00)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1260s). - The speaker suggests that eschatology has been used to further both conservative and liberal agendas, and that rejecting dispensationalism was often linked to a social justice leaning [(00:21:47)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1307s). - The speaker argues that simply adopting a postmillennial position is not a solution to the problems faced by Christian conservatives, and that a deeper understanding of eschatology and its implications is needed [(00:21:38)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1298s). ## The Complexities of Church and State Relations - The relationship between church and state, as well as the [[Role | role]] of government in enforcing Christian laws, is influenced by various factors beyond eschatology, which is often cited as the determining factor in these debates [(00:22:15)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1335s). - A comprehensive understanding of the relationship between church and state requires considering multiple threads, including anthropology, divinely delegated authority, and the limits of authority, which can be complex and easily thrown off [(00:23:09)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1389s). ## The Spheres of Authority and the Fall's Impact - A flawed anthropology can lead to errors in understanding the role of government and the church, as seen in the 2020 mantra that those in power were looking out for the best interests of citizens, which was later proven to be totalitarianism [(00:24:00)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1440s). - The biblical basics of [[Political theology | political theology]] involve understanding the spheres created by [[God]], including the sphere of self, family, and government, each with its own structure, purpose, and direction [(00:24:30)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1470s). - The structure of the family sphere, for example, is based on the biblical model of husband and wife, with the husband as the head, and this structure is corrupted by the fall, leading to errors in understanding the purpose and definition of the family [(00:24:50)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1490s). - [[United States Declaration of Independence | The Declaration of Independence]] reflects a Christian worldview, stating that all men are created by their creator and given certain inalienable rights, which is a fundamental principle that should be affirmed [(00:25:33)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1533s). - The basis of being [[United States | American]] is rooted in the idea that there is a Creator who has given inalienable rights, and it's the government's job to secure those rights [(00:25:48)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1548s). - God alone has rights, including the right to be obeyed, worshiped, and loved, which creates obligations for individuals to obey, worship, and love Him [(00:26:00)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1560s). - Individuals have the right to life, and as beings made in the image of God, they have the obligation to represent and worship Him [(00:26:30)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1590s). - The introduction of the fall led to corrupted theology and definitions, including a corrupted definition of what it means to be human, as seen in transhumanism [(00:26:46)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1606s). - The civil government is not necessarily a post-fall institution, as [[Revelation 21]] describes the [[Jerusalem | New Jerusalem]] with kings and nations, indicating that civil authority will still exist in the Eternal State [(00:27:12)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1632s). - The [[Role | role]] of education is to teach spiritual and horizontal matters, and parents have the obligation and right to educate their children in these areas [(00:28:25)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1705s). - However, corrupted individual spheres within families can lead to a wrong view of [[God]], self, and creation being taught, which can further corrupt individuals and ultimately affect the civil government [(00:28:55)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1735s). - The education system is tied to the family and government, creating corrupted spheres that don't recognize God's authority, leading to statism, where the state defines and grants rights, and individuals become accountable only to the state [(00:29:21)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1761s). - This statism is perpetuated through the government and schools, controlling what is taught and leading to a self-perpetuating cycle, resulting in a statist society [(00:29:45)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1785s). - The civil government, not recognizing God's authority, co-opts the schools and controls their teachings, ultimately leading to a society where the state has ultimate authority [(00:30:03)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1803s). - Christians may carve out a small section where the state doesn't have authority, such as in the teaching of the word and ordinances, but this is not enough to counter the overall statist trend [(00:30:30)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1830s). - Getting education, anthropology, and divinely delegated authority wrong can lead to a gradual erosion of values and principles, resulting in a kind of "Death By A Thousand Cuts" [(00:30:51)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1851s). ## Mudhead Mama: An Alternative to Traditional Book Fairs - Mudhead Mama is a company that offers an alternative to traditional book fairs, providing a curated collection of quality books that align with family values and promote character and virtue in readers of all ages [(00:31:04)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1864s). - The company's mission is to empower parents to guide their children's hearts and minds through thoughtful, faith-filled reading choices, and they offer a wide range of genres, including classic literature, biographies, and historical fiction [(00:31:28)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1888s). ## Political Theology and the Church's Mission - The conversation touches on the idea that understanding one's [[Role | role]], relationship to [[God]], and God's expectations is crucial in shaping a correct posture in [[Political theology | political theology]] [(00:32:10)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1930s). - The government, according to [[Romans 13]], cannot use its delegated authority to stop true worship from taking place, as the church is a separate institution with separate responsibilities and the right to worship [(00:32:36)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1956s). - A conversation was had with someone who believes Christian nationalists confuse the church's mission with their own political philosophy, and that Christians should not look to the government for salvation, but rather focus their efforts on the institutional Church, as anything else is considered idolatry [(00:32:57)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=1977s). - The idea was presented that Christians should not be involved in politics or government, and that doing so would be a form of idolatry, but this perspective was questioned as it seems inconsistent with the fact that Christians are involved in various other aspects of society, such as Christian bookstores, music, and conferences [(00:33:21)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2001s). - The concept of a "Christian family" was discussed, and how it is acceptable to refer to a family as Christian, even if not all members are theologically Christian, and how this concept can be applied to other institutions, such as governments [(00:33:54)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2034s). - The question was raised as to why it would be a problem for a government to be self-aware of its Christian identity, especially in areas where the majority of the population is Christian, and where Christians hold political roles [(00:34:28)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2068s). ## Public Education, Religious Liberty, and the Government's Role - The issue of public education being revisionistic was brought up, and how the [[First Amendment to the United States Constitution | First Amendment]] was originally ratified in a time when states had state churches and religious tests for office, and how blasphemy laws were in place until around 1950 [(00:35:32)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2132s). - The idea was presented that the government has generally been benevolent up until 2020, and that this is why people were caught off guard and did not consider the implications of their actions on anthropology [(00:36:18)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2178s). - Nations are inherently religious because people are naturally inclined to have a worldview, and governments will inevitably have a religious worldview, pointing to a higher authority and defining good and rights, which are ultimately spiritual claims [(00:36:31)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2191s). - The government's worldview can be pluralistic, polytheistic, communist, atheistic, naturalistic, or materialistic, but it will always have a worldview, and the argument is that it should be a Christian worldview [(00:37:26)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2246s). - The foundation of this idea is that a Creator gave rights to his creation, and it's the government's job to protect those rights, as stated in the US founding documents [(00:37:45)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2265s). ## Psalm 2 and the King's Religion - [[Psalm 2]] is cited as an example of how, in the [[Old Testament]], the king's religion was the nation's religion, and the king was expected to publicly worship and obey [[God]] [(00:38:09)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2289s). - In the context of Psalm 2, if a king were to "kiss the son," it would mean declaring [[Yahweh]] as the one true God and judging according to His revelation [(00:38:50)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2330s). - The idea of "principled pluralism" is mentioned, which suggests that a nation can accommodate different religions, but this concept is not fully explained or endorsed [(00:39:20)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2360s). - The example of [[Israel]] is given, where one did not have to convert to Yahwehism to join the nation, but this point is not fully developed [(00:40:02)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2402s). ## Personal Theological Stance and Hermeneutics - The speaker identifies as a dispensationalist and mentions that they champion a literal, grammatical, historical hermeneutic, but also acknowledges that they may differ from some fellow dispensationalists [(00:38:02)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2282s). - The speaker also mentions that they would be a [[Neo-Calvinism | neo-Calvinist]], but not in the style of [[Tim Keller (pastor) | Tim Keller]] [(00:39:51)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2391s). - In the biblical context, [[Israelites | non-Israelites]] could reside in the territory and participate in some laws, but not all, and were not required to worship [[Yahweh]], although they couldn't publicly evangelize for their own religions [(00:40:10)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2410s). - Non-Israelites could enter the land, live there, and be Sojourners, but they weren't forced to worship Yahweh, and if they didn't become a priest, they couldn't engage in public worship [(00:40:28)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2428s). ## Blasphemy Laws, Religious Restrictions, and Government Authority - The government can enact blasphemy laws without forcing people to worship, as having blasphemy laws doesn't necessarily mean forcing people to worship, and all countries have some form of blasphemy laws [(00:41:19)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2479s). - Totalitarian nations do force people to worship, but having laws against blasphemy or publicly practicing certain religions doesn't mean people can't practice them privately [(00:41:53)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2513s). - The government can restrict public practice of certain religions without forcing conversions, and this is different from totalitarian nations that punish people for not affirming certain ideologies [(00:42:06)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2526s). - The government can prioritize the "road" to true religion and maintain it, while not encouraging or maintaining the "roads" to other religions, using state expenditure [(00:42:37)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2557s). - This idea is related to issues like [[Satan]] monuments and invocations from [[Christianity | non-Christian]] groups, which can be seen as giving equal privilege to other religions [(00:43:04)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2584s). - The forces of darkness use the logic of [[Freedom of religion | religious liberty]] to push for equal treatment of their beliefs, but this can be seen as an opportunity for them to spread their influence [(00:43:35)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2615s). - Historically, some people believed that [[Satanism | Satanists]] wouldn't be a problem because they wouldn't show up, but now that they do, it's a challenge to argue against them, especially when there's no neutrality in a society that's not monolithic in its beliefs [(00:43:45)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2625s). - Every nation has religious restrictions on what's tolerated and what's not, such as not allowing [[Mormons | Mormon]] polygamy or [[Muslims | Muslim]] child brides, despite these being part of their religious observances [(00:44:42)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2682s). ## The Church's Role vs. Individual Christians in Politics - As Christians, it's believed that the job of the church is not to get involved in politics, but rather the job of individual Christians to get involved in politics [(00:44:56)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2696s). ## The Cultural Mandate and Human Creativity - The concept of the cultural mandate is emphasized, which is the idea that [[God]] gives humans the task to be fruitful, multiply, fill the [[Earth]], and create culture, as seen in Genesis [(00:45:25)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2725s). - The cultural mandate is not just about filling the Earth with people, but also with culture, as seen in Genesis 6 where the Earth is filled with violence, and in Genesis 4 where Cain and his descendants carry out the cultural mandate by creating culture, such as urbanization, music, and specialized husbandry [(00:45:46)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2746s). - The story of [[Lamech (descendant of Cain) | Lamech]] in Genesis 4 is an example of the cultural mandate in action, where he and his sons create new things, such as metal instruments, and Lamech writes a song that is considered to be the first "gangster rap" song [(00:47:00)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2820s). - The cultural mandate is seen as a key part of being in the image of God, as humans are designed to be culture makers, and culture helps shape us [(00:46:03)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2763s). - There is a need to go back to the early chapters of Genesis to understand the theological implications of the cultural mandate, rather than just focusing on the scientific aspects [(00:46:14)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2774s). ## The Fallen Line, the Redeemed Line, and Cultural Engagement - The concept of the "Fallen line" and the "redeemed line" is discussed, where the sons of [[Satan]] are actively involved in carrying out the cultural mandate, corrupting every sphere they enter, while the sons of [[God]] are supposed to engage the culture and create systems for the glory of their spiritual father [(00:47:32)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2852s). - The cultural mandate is a natural part of being in the image of God, and both believers and unbelievers are carrying it out, but with different motivations and goals [(00:47:49)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2869s). - As Christians, it is their responsibility to engage the culture and create spheres and systems for the glory of God, but if they back away from this responsibility, the [[Godless (miniseries) | Godless]] will fill the vacuum and further corrupt it [(00:48:15)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2895s). - The Great Commission subsumes the cultural mandate, and as believers, they are to build Godly, God-honoring institutions and systems for the glory of their spiritual father [(00:48:30)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2910s). - Unbelievers are building out the world for their own glory, influenced by the prince of the power of the air, while believers are to build for the glory of God [(00:48:41)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=2921s). ## The "Judeo-Christian" Phrase and Its Implications - The concept of the "[[Judeo-Christian]]" phrase is discussed, and it is seen as a way to imply a league between [[Jews]] and Christians, and an invitation for [[Judaism | Jewish]] people to operate on an equal footing with Christians in the civil sphere [(00:50:00)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3000s). - Dispensationalists have been weak in addressing the issue of the "Judeo-Christian" phrase, and it is a contentious issue that needs to be addressed [(00:50:45)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3045s). ## The Mosaic Covenant, the Abrahamic Covenant, and the Regathering of Israel - [[Moses]] told [[Israel]] that they would disobey, be scattered, and then be regathered when they turned to the Lord with all their heart, as stated in [[Book of Deuteronomy | Deuteronomy]] 31:6, which outlines the terms and conditions of [[Mosaic covenant | the Mosaic Covenant]] and its inevitable consequences [(00:50:56)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3056s). - The Mosaic Covenant is now obsolete and has been replaced by a new covenant, as stated in [[Hebrews]], but the promise of regathering is tied to the [[Covenant of the pieces | Abrahamic Covenant]], not the Mosaic Covenant [(00:51:19)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3079s). - In the future, ethnic Israel will be regenerated and gathered back into the land as a regenerated people, which is a promise throughout the [[Old Testament]] [(00:51:35)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3095s). ## Modern Judaism vs. Old Testament Judaism - Modern [[Judaism]], including Reform, Orthodox, and Ultra-[[Orthodox Judaism]], is not the same as Old Testament Judaism, which ended with the Babylonian captivity, and is now a form of Rabbi Judaism [(00:52:12)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3132s). - Dispensationalists should be able to say that modern Judaism is not biblical Judaism, as it lacks a Temple, sacrifices, and priests, and is different from the Judaism of Paul, John the Baptist, [[Jesus]], and the prophets [(00:52:40)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3160s). - Ethnic [[Jews]] are still under the curses of [[Mosaic covenant | the Mosaic Covenant]], scattered, and judicially hardened, according to [[Isaiah 6]] and Romans, and are still experiencing the consequences of their disobedience [(00:53:05)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3185s). - Jesus said that [[Jerusalem]] would be trampled by the [[Gentile | Gentiles]] until the end, and [[God]] will gather the Jews back after they corporately turn to Him, but the modern nation of [[Israel]] is not the biblical nation of Israel [(00:53:50)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3230s). - The biblical nation of Israel is a regenerate national Israel that will be converted and gathered back into the land, trusting in [[Yahweh]], which is different from the modern nation of Israel and modern Judaism [(00:54:15)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3255s). - Modern Judaism is anti-trinitarian, worships a different God, and has rejected God's self-revelation, making it not biblical Judaism [(00:54:35)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3275s). ## The Modern Nation-State of Israel and Its Theological Status - A rabid dispensationalist believes modern ethnic [[Jews]] do not have a right to the land of [[Canaan]] due to their covenant disobedience, and this right will be restored when they turn back to the Lord, according to the [[Covenant of the pieces | Abrahamic Covenant]] [(00:54:55)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3295s). - Dispensationalists should be able to say the modern nation-state of [[Israel]] is not the biblical Israel, as they are apostate and do not have a theological right to the land, but they may have a geopolitical right to autonomy and self-protection [(00:55:20)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3320s). - Genesis 49 makes it clear that all 12 tribes will be around in the last days, and there are enough scattered Jews to fulfill this prophecy, but the current regathering of Jews in Israel is an act of high-handed rebellion because they do not have a theological claim to the land [(00:56:01)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3361s). - As a dispensationalist, it is believed that Israel will get purged even further in the future, according to the [[Old Testament]], and they should not expect divine protection, but [[God]] could allow the current nation to be wiped out and still have enough ethnic Jews to be regathered in the future [(00:56:53)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3413s). ## Dispensationalism and the Misconceptions about Israel - Dispensationalists have not done a good job of delineating what is true and what is not, leading to the misconception that they support the modern nation-state of Israel because they think they have a right to the land and worship the same God [(00:57:22)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3442s). - The term "[[Judeo-Christian]]" is used to describe the idea that there is a connection between [[Christianity]] and [[Judaism]], but this is not necessarily true, and it is used in practical politics to widen the [[Republican Party (United States) | Republican]] base and gain support from rich Jewish donors [(00:57:48)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3468s). - The concept of "Judeo-Christian" has become representative of giving a privileged status to Jewish people, and this phrase is a relatively new term that was not used by historical figures like [[George Washington]] [(00:58:47)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3527s). ## National Identity: Covenant vs. Natural Relationships - The idea of [[Christian nationalism]] is being debated, with some arguing that a nation's identity comes solely from the Covenant, while others believe it comes from the family or natural relationships [(00:59:36)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3576s). - The Covenant of [[Israel]] is cited as an example, where people could be part of the Covenant community by bowing to [[Yahweh]], but there were limitations and restrictions on integration into civil society [(00:59:50)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3590s). - Some people, including the speaker, believe that the family is the basis for nations, and that being born into a family or nation comes with obligations and privileges that one did not consent to [(01:00:43)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3643s). - The speaker suggests that nations are an extension of the natural relationships found in families, and that they work in their own best interests, with individuals having obligations and privileges as a result of being born into a nation [(01:01:17)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3677s). ## The Basis of National Identity: Covenant, Natural Law, or Theonomy? - The debate over national identity is framed as a choice between natural law, theonomy, and Covenant, with some people arguing that national identity is based on the Covenant, while others believe it is based on natural relationships or family [(01:00:32)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3632s). - The speaker is seeking an opinion on whether national identity is based on Covenant or natural relationships, and is open to different perspectives on the matter [(01:01:54)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3714s). ## National Covenants and God's Federal Dealings - A discussion is being held on whether nations can make a covenant with [[God]], aside from [[Israel]], and if so, what scriptural evidence supports this claim [(01:02:17)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3737s). - It is argued that God deals federally with nations, meaning that the actions of a nation's leader can impact its citizens, similar to how a father's actions can affect his family [(01:02:49)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3769s). ## The Formation of Nations and the Importance of Language - Biblically, nations were formed after the [[Tower of Babel]], resulting in ethnic people groups, and it is essential to differentiate between ethnicity and race [(01:03:14)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3794s). - The Founders of the [[United States]] agreed that a nation should have one language, one religion, and one set of customs and cultures, as stated in the Federalist letters [(01:03:52)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3832s). - A person's nationality is often determined by their birth and lineage, but they can also change nations if they choose to, and there are concentric circles of obligation to love one's neighbor and community [(01:04:22)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3862s). - The question arises whether a nation is defined by birth or by affirming a covenant, and it is argued that being born in a nation obligates an individual to its people and customs, unless those customs are at enmity with [[God]] [(01:04:51)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3891s). - In the context of the United States, it is difficult to accept someone as an American citizen if they reject [[United States Declaration of Independence | the Declaration of Independence]] and its principles, such as the idea that men are created by a Creator and have inalienable rights [(01:05:29)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3929s). - A shared language is necessary for a local church or a nation to function, as it is difficult to have a unified entity without a common language [(01:06:08)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3968s). - If a nation has a constitution or covenant and an individual disagrees with it, they may be considered an enemy of the people or the nation [(01:06:25)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=3985s). ## National Identity and Shared Assumptions - The concept of national identity is being debated, with some arguing that it is rooted in the ability to ascent to a covenant, while others believe it is more complex [(01:06:46)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4006s). - National identity is not solely based on politics, but also on shared assumptions about life, such as music, work ethic, and cultural practices [(01:09:02)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4142s). - These shared assumptions can vary greatly between countries and cultures, and can be a source of conflict or misunderstanding [(01:09:18)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4158s). ## Proposition Nations and the Complexity of National Identity - The idea of a "proposition nation" suggests that nations are abstractions and that individuals can choose to ascent to them, but this idea is being challenged [(01:07:33)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4053s). - In a family context, an individual can reject their family and become an enemy of the family by attacking its core values and principles [(01:08:29)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4109s). - The concept of family and national identity is complex and multifaceted, and is influenced by a variety of factors, including history, culture, and shared experiences [(01:08:40)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4120s). - **The** **American** **Revolution** is an example of a shared struggle that has helped to shape American identity and values [(01:08:47)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4127s). - The idea of a nation as a body politic bound together by shared experiences and values is an important concept in understanding national identity [(01:08:43)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4123s). ## Cultural Identity and Its Influence - A person's identity and cultural background are deeply ingrained and cannot be easily changed, even if they move to a different country or reject their upbringing [(01:09:35)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4175s). - The United States is considered more of an empire than a nation, and this complexity can contribute to identity issues for individuals who have moved around or have diverse family backgrounds [(01:09:57)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4197s). - Cultural identity is often tied to the region or community where a person was raised, and it can be difficult to quantify or define what it means to be from a particular place or culture [(01:10:14)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4214s). - Despite the challenges of defining cultural identity, it is often recognizable and can be sensed through patterns of life, traditions, and development [(01:11:11)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4271s). - A person's accent, behavior, and values can be indicative of their cultural background, and these traits can be difficult to shake, even if they move to a different region or country [(01:11:36)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4296s). - The concept of cultural identity is not rigid and can be complex, making it challenging to create laws or policies that reflect the nuances of individual identities [(01:10:58)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4258s). - Cultural identity is often rooted in family, community, and traditions, and it can be observed in the way people interact with each other and their surroundings [(01:12:16)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4336s). - Patterns of life, traditions, and development are essential in shaping a person's cultural identity, and these factors can be more influential than physical appearance or other characteristics [(01:12:35)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4355s). ## Ancestry and the Nuances of Human Identity - The concept of ancestry plays a [[Role | role]] in shaping the identity of people, and it is not solely defined by a covenant, as some theonomic postmillenarians might suggest, but also by other factors that make people different [(01:12:41)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4361s). - The idea that people's differences are solely based on a covenant does not take into account the complexities and nuances of human identity [(01:12:53)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4373s). ## The Assyrian Empire's Strategy and Modern Parallels - The Assyrian Empire's strategy of conquering people groups, removing a significant portion of the population, and replacing them with people from other nations is seen as a historical example of how diversity can be used to control and manipulate populations [(01:13:32)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4412s). - This strategy is compared to the current situation in the country, where diversity is being used to break down cultural homogeneity and create a more fragmented society [(01:14:03)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4443s). - The concept of borders and national identity is closely tied to this idea, and the speaker suggests that the current situation is similar to the [[Assyria | Assyrian Empire]] 2.0 [(01:14:16)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4456s). - The speaker mentions that they have written about this topic in their book, using the example of the [[Syrians]], and notes that this is not a positive example in scripture [(01:14:23)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4463s). ## Conclusion and Further Resources - The speaker recommends checking out their [[YouTube]] page, which features playlists on topics such as [[Dispensationalism | dispensationalism]], [[Christian nationalism]], and biblical basics of [[Political theology | political theology]] [(01:14:47)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4487s). - The conversation ends with an appreciation for the opportunity to discuss these topics and a farewell message [(01:15:01)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LORlSLleauY&t=4501s).