# Escaping IFB Abuse And Lies with Ryan George  ## Intro [(00:00:00)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=0s) - The podcast contains clips from some [[Minister (Christianity) | Pastors]] in the [[Independent Baptist | Independent Fundamental Baptist]] Church (IFB) who shamed rape victims in their sermons, which are used to illustrate the systemic problems in IFB churches [(00:00:00)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=0s). - Research shows that more than 95% of women who report being raped are telling the truth, but in some churches, especially IFB churches, these women are disbelieved and shamed [(00:00:28)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=28s). - The IFB propaganda machine is meant to consolidate and maintain power, and it promotes misogynist propaganda and violence, especially towards those seen as political foes [(00:00:41)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=41s). - Some IFB pastors have promoted violence towards political opponents, including making statements about assassinating [[Joe Biden]] after his election [(00:01:19)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=79s). - The podcast also features a clip from [[John MacArthur (American pastor) | John MacArthur]], a famous preacher who sounds similar to an IFB pastor [(00:01:40)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=100s). - Ryan George, the son of an IFB pastor, confidently asserts that the IFB church is a cult and shares his story of escaping the IFB and overcoming fear [(00:01:35)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=95s). - The podcast is sponsored by [[Judson University]], a top-ranked [[Christianity | Christian]] university providing a caring community and excellent college experience, and Mar Hort of Barington, a [[Buick]] [[GMC (marque) | GMC]] dealership known for honesty, integrity, and transparency [(00:02:00)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=120s). ## IFB Propaganda [(00:02:49)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=169s) - The IFB ([[New Independent Fundamental Baptist Movement | Independent Fundamentalist Baptist]]) movement used propaganda to sell certain ideas, including extra-biblical ideas that weren't necessarily in scripture, to its followers [(00:03:13)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=193s). - One such idea was that a woman who gets pregnant from rape must have enjoyed the experience, and therefore it was her fault if she became pregnant [(00:03:37)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=217s). - This idea is considered despicable and misogynistic, and is an example of the kind of propaganda used by the IFB movement to control and manipulate its followers [(00:03:52)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=232s). - Jack Hiles, a prominent figure in the IFB movement, was known for spreading such ideas and had a large following at his church, [[First Baptist Church (Hammond, Indiana) | First Baptist of Hammond]] in [[Indiana]] [(00:04:28)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=268s). - Hiles was known for his bus ministry, which at its peak had 86 buses and was a major part of his church's outreach efforts [(00:04:40)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=280s). - A clip of Hiles speaking was referenced, in which he likens women who don't dress in a way he considers appropriate to the wicked men who were beheaded in 2 Kings 10 [(00:06:20)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=380s). - The context of the clip was researched, and it was found that Hiles was referencing the story of [[Jehu]], who meted out God's judgment to the wicked King [[Ahab]] and Queen [[Jezebel]] [(00:05:16)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=316s). - The story of Jehu is a graphic description of God's judgment being meted out to the wicked, but Hiles' use of it to describe women who don't dress in a way he considers appropriate is considered breathtaking and misogynistic [(00:06:33)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=393s). ## Sexual Abuse [(00:06:44)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=404s) - A sermon by Jack Hiles is referenced, in which he blames women for being raped, stating that for every man who goes to prison for rape, a "half-naked girl" should be in the next cell, implying that the woman is at fault for the man's actions [(00:07:06)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=426s). - The sermon is criticized for its harmful message, particularly for women who may have been sexually abused and are being told that they are to blame for the abuse [(00:08:01)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=481s). - David Hiles, Jack Hiles' son, has been accused of rape by several women, and a podcast interview with one of the alleged victims is mentioned [(00:08:09)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=489s). - A link to the podcast is provided in the show notes for those who want to learn more about the allegations against David Hiles [(00:08:23)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=503s). - Jack Hiles' son-in-law was convicted of taking a 16-year-old girl across state lines and raping her, and he blamed the girl's "aggressiveness" for the crime [(00:08:43)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=523s). - The culture of blaming women for men's actions is criticized for being deeply ingrained in the [[New Independent Fundamental Baptist Movement | Independent Fundamentalist Baptist]] (IFB) movement [(00:09:07)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=547s). - A recent example of a pastor, Bobby Leonard, from [[Bible]] Baptist Tabernacle in [[North Carolina]], is given, who made similar comments to Jack Hiles, blaming women for being raped, and this incident occurred within the past year [(00:09:50)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=590s). ## Pastor Bobby Leonard [(00:09:58)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=598s) - Pastor Bobby Leonard used to make a statement that if a woman dresses in a certain way and gets raped, the perpetrator would go free, implying that the victim's attire is to blame for the crime [(00:09:59)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=599s). - This statement is problematic as it shifts the responsibility from the perpetrator to the victim and implies that the victim's actions or appearance justify the crime [(00:10:02)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=602s). - The statement also reflects a narrow and misguided definition of manhood, which is emphasized by the phrase "a man's a man" [(00:10:17)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=617s). - This definition of manhood is further highlighted as being defined by the group or community, rather than being an inherent quality [(00:10:19)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=619s). ## A man is a man [(00:10:20)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=620s) - A viral video of Pastor Bobby Leonard from an IFB church sparked protests due to his comments that a woman's clothing can give a man a license to rape her, with the pastor still holding his position at the church [(00:10:24)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=624s). - The pastor's views are in contrast to the teachings of [[Jesus]], who showed compassion to victims and was hard on religious hypocrites, with Jesus' heart breaking for those caught in sin and victimized [(00:11:15)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=675s). - The story of the woman caught in adultery is mentioned, with the possibility that she was a victim and the fact that only she was brought to Jesus to be stoned, while her partner was not [(00:11:35)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=695s). - The IFB church's views on women and sin are criticized, with the pastor's comments being seen as antithetical to Jesus' teachings [(00:12:30)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=750s). - [[Christianity | Christian]] nationalism is discussed as a component of IFB churches, with the idea of taking control and overtaking the culture being promoted, using authoritarian terms [(00:13:02)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=782s). - The use of force and coercion to spread the church's message is mentioned, with the example of a church raffling off a shotgun to attract new members [(00:13:19)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=799s). - The IFB church's involvement in politics is noted, with polling places on the campus of the college attended by the speaker [(00:14:06)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=846s). - The [[Independent Baptist | Independent Fundamental Baptist]] (IFB) church has been accused of multiple sexual crimes against minors, with some members bragging about influencing elections, including the 2000 US presidential election, by getting students to change their voting district to the college district in [[Florida]], which they claim was enough to put [[George W. Bush | George Bush]] over the top [(00:14:10)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=850s). - The IFB church's authoritarian nature and emphasis on winning America back to [[God]] may be linked to their support for political authoritarians, such as [[Donald Trump]], who talks about retribution and making people pay [(00:14:42)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=882s). - The church's interpretation of [[Bible | the Bible]], specifically the passage about separating the sheep from the goats, is used to justify their belief that certain nations will be separated and judged by God, creating a sense of double jeopardy [(00:15:07)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=907s). - The IFB church's emphasis on the [[King James Version | King James version of the Bible]] as the only true version, and some pastors' claims that the [[English language | English]] version is more inspired than the original, is seen as a flawed and narrow interpretation [(00:15:31)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=931s). - The church's goal of "winning America back to God" is not about saving [[Americans]], but rather about saving their own version of America, which is seen as a messed-up version [(00:16:10)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=970s). - The idea that [[Jesus]] would choose a specific country or nation is seen as flawed, as countries and borders have changed throughout history, and it is unclear when or how Jesus would make such a choice [(00:16:32)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=992s). - The IFB church's lack of intellectual rigor and resistance to academic inquiry is seen as a problem, with those who question the church's teachings being labeled as liberals or lacking faith [(00:16:48)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1008s). - Some [[Minister (Christianity) | pastors]] have made extreme statements, including suggesting that God's will might be to assassinate [[Joe Biden]], which is seen as a misinterpretation of Jesus' teachings and a call to violence [(00:17:05)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1025s). - There is a chapter called "Misrepresenting Orthodoxy" that discusses IFB preachers who condemn certain groups or people in a selective and self-righteous manner [(00:17:43)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1063s). - These preachers often misrepresent the truth and apply different standards to themselves and others, as seen in the example of the author's father, who was a pedophile and molested underage girls [(00:17:58)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1078s). - Despite his own serious wrongdoing, the author's father would condemn others, such as [[Martin Luther King Jr. | Martin Luther King Jr]], for alleged infidelity, highlighting the hypocrisy and double standard [(00:18:07)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1087s). - The author notes that the relationships Martin Luther King Jr was accused of having were likely consensual, in contrast to the author's father's non-consensual abuse of underage girls [(00:18:23)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1103s). - The author finds it ironic that their father would condemn others for lesser wrongdoing while hiding his own more serious and harmful actions [(00:18:30)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1110s). ## Macro irony [(00:18:31)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1111s) - The disregard for Dr. King in the churches of one's youth is an example of macro irony, particularly when considering the contrast between the church's teachings and its actions [(00:18:36)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1116s). - In these churches, beliefs were idolized, and hypocrisy was justified as a means to protect the gospel, rather than promoting authenticity and compassion [(00:18:41)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1121s). - [[Dogma | Dogmatism]] took precedence over following Jesus' example, with doctrine being prioritized over values like curiosity and empathy [(00:18:46)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1126s). ## John MacArthur MLK [(00:18:59)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1139s) - A controversy has arisen over John MacArthur's comments about [[Martin Luther King Jr.]], which are being shared so that people can hear what he said [(00:19:12)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1152s). - [[John MacArthur (American pastor) | John MacArthur]] stated that Martin Luther King Jr. was not a [[Christianity | Christian]], had an immoral life, and misrepresented Christ and the gospel, but did do some social good and was a pacifist [(00:19:42)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1182s). - MacArthur questioned why a nonbeliever like Martin Luther King Jr. would be honored in the same way as a Christian like [[R. C. Sproul | RC Sproul]] [(00:20:07)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1207s). - John MacArthur has been accused of hypocrisy for covering up for multiple child molesters in his church while criticizing Martin Luther King Jr. for his personal life [(00:20:22)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1222s). - MacArthur's church has been accused of keeping people who have done worse things than Martin Luther King Jr. in the church and presenting them as examples of the faith [(00:20:32)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1232s). - The IFB church has been accused of using mental gymnastics to feel self-righteous, such as saying that Martin Luther King Jr.'s personal life wipes out everything he did, including his chances of going to heaven [(00:20:48)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1248s). ## Pride [(00:20:55)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1255s) - One of the greatest sins [[God]] calls out is pride, and saying a human can determine the eternal destiny of someone else crosses a line into hubris [(00:20:59)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1259s). - Dr. [[Martin Luther King Jr. | Martin Luther King]] was a Baptist pastor in the South, likely theologically conservative, which is ironic given some criticisms of him [(00:21:28)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1288s). - The last section of a book talks about moving beyond abuse and [[Dogma | dogmatism]], and choosing growth over comfort, which can be a risky but important path [(00:21:42)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1302s). - It's possible to find "greener pastures" beyond the abuse and dogmatism, and these experiences don't have to define one's life [(00:21:45)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1305s). - Choosing growth over comfort can be a difficult but ultimately rewarding decision, and it's worth taking the risk [(00:22:29)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1349s). - The body is designed to respond positively to overcoming fears, releasing chemicals like dopamine and epinephrine as a reward [(00:22:54)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1374s). - Overcoming fears and trying new things can make a person feel most alive, both physically and in their faith [(00:23:00)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1380s). - Experiencing [[Jesus]] and seeing him work in people's lives can be a powerful and life-changing experience, giving a sense of what "life in all caps" is [(00:24:10)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1450s). - The concept of feeling [[God]] the most when scared is discussed, and it is mentioned that leaning into fear can lead to a reward that is at least equal to the fear itself [(00:24:22)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1462s). - A personal experience of overcoming fear is shared, where the individual jumped off the 63rd story of a building despite being scared of heights, and found the experience to be rewarding [(00:24:33)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1473s). - The idea that some experiences, including those related to faith, cannot be explained or convinced to others is discussed, and it is compared to trying to convince a child that they will like something in the future [(00:24:47)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1487s). - The individual shares that they have had encounters with Jesus that are sweeter than any experience they had with their parents or in churches growing up, and that these experiences cannot be explained outside of Jesus [(00:25:08)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1508s). - The importance of inviting others to experience things that may be scary or uncomfortable, but can lead to personal growth and a deeper connection with Jesus, is emphasized [(00:25:23)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1523s). - The concept of an "invitational model" is mentioned, where individuals are encouraged to face their fears and relinquish control to [[Jesus]], and it is stated that this model has proven true in the individual's life [(00:25:45)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1545s). ## Living The Adventure [(00:25:50)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1550s) - The decision to expose the truth about the **Moody** **Bible** **Institute** was a terrifying experience, as it would likely result in being blacklisted and ending one's career, but it ultimately led to a sense of being alive and living the adventure that life in Christ should be [(00:25:53)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1553s). - The Bible says that the just shall live by faith, but this implies that faith requires doubt or fear, and living by faith on a regular basis means regularly facing and overcoming these emotions [(00:26:58)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1618s). - To be a moral and Godly person requires courage, as [[God]] will call individuals to tasks that require faith and facing their fears [(00:27:59)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1679s). - Pursuing one's own healing can be a scary process, as it involves confronting painful experiences and emotions, but it is a necessary step towards healing and growth [(00:28:13)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1693s). - Healing is a process that will not be fully completed until heaven, but those who have walked through difficult experiences can offer guidance and reassurance to others who are struggling [(00:28:46)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1726s). - Everyone's journey towards healing and growth is unique and nuanced, and there is no one-size-fits-all solution, but individuals are called to trust the process and take steps towards healing and recovery [(00:28:59)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1739s). - Finding a version of [[Jesus]] to fall in love with is crucial, and this can be achieved by finding a spiritual community or meeting people who share the same love for Jesus, whether through a service or casual meetings, such as going for coffee [(00:29:16)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1756s). - For some people, the first step in finding Jesus is going to therapy, where they can be real and tell their story, eventually gaining the courage to share it with others outside of the therapy room [(00:29:57)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1797s). - The goal is not to go back to church on Sundays, but to fall in love with Jesus, which can be a personally rewarding experience, and this relationship can be seen as a personal connection between the individual and Jesus [(00:30:10)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1810s). - Jesus is everywhere, and people are attracted to him, so finding him can be a divine scavenger hunt, and intentionally looking for him can lead to answers and revelations [(00:30:42)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1842s). - Praying to find Jesus and seeking him with one's whole heart can lead to answers, as promised in [[Bible | the Bible]], and this can be done in various situations, such as before going on a hike or getting on a flight [(00:30:46)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1846s). - Jesus can reveal himself in unexpected ways, and being expectant of finding the real Jesus can lead to a deeper understanding of him, as he gave his life for people to know him [(00:31:36)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1896s). - Unfortunately, some people have not been shown the true self of [[Jesus]], and it is essential to find the real Jesus, which can be a life-changing experience [(00:31:51)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1911s). - Julie Roys is reporting the truth and restoring the church, and she wants to remind viewers that Ryan's book will be given away to anyone who gives a gift of $30 or more to the Roys Report this month [(00:32:26)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1946s). - Viewers can support the work and get the book by going to [[Donation | JulieRoys.com/donate]] [(00:32:40)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1960s). - Julie Roys encourages viewers to subscribe to the Roys Report on Apple Podcast, [[Google Podcasts | Google Podcast]], Spotify, or [[YouTube]] to stay updated on episodes [(00:32:50)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1970s). - She also appreciates help in spreading the word about the podcast by leaving a review and sharing it on social media [(00:33:04)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tbf5FsOm0o&t=1984s).